Cafe Hayek - Latest Comments in What is vs. what I wish it were

Re: What is vs. what I wish it were

Lee — Wed, 24 Jan 2007 06:52:43 -0000

Most of you are confusing two seperate interpretations of "the purpose of government."

1. The purposeful actions of those individuals that comprise government.

2. The purpose intended for the institution of government.

The second could be many things to many different people. To the Democrat, the government's purpose may be to protect the poor from the wealthy. To the Republican, the government's purpose may be to promote and enforce particular moral values. To the Libertarian, the government's purpose is simply to maintain personal liberty and property rights.

Russell was getting at the first meaning. The purposes, incentives, motivations, goals etc. of those who comprise governmental institutions, who continue to pursue their own goals irrespective of the multitude of purposes others may attach to their activities.

Re: What is vs. what I wish it were

Ryan Fuller — Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:40:05 -0000

"Then how do you suggest government be fixed?"

If a child were wandering around an antique shop with a hammer, how would you fix that? I'd probably start by taking away its power to break things, then put it in an out of the way corner someplace.

Re: What is vs. what I wish it were

Python — Tue, 23 Jan 2007 22:23:06 -0000

The goal of the government? Look no further than the introduction to the document which forms the government:

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

What is up for debate is how the government goes about these things. How should the government "insure domestic Tranquility"? Well, at the very least it should not override the call to "...secure the Blessings of Liberty..."

Somehow along the way, the word "welfare" changed from a descriptive noun (like "childhood") into a social program. When do we get the social program for "tranquility" or "Liberty" or even "pursuit of happiness"? Actually, the fewer programs we have the more Liberty we can use.

Re: What is vs. what I wish it were

triticale — Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:38:05 -0000

What is the goal of government? We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.

Re: What is vs. what I wish it were

Bart Hinkle — Tue, 23 Jan 2007 04:34:16 -0000

The primary task of government is to protect individual rights and secure liberty. Anytime government puts a secondary or tertiary purpose ahead of that primary purpose, it goes astray -- and starts thinking of, say, national security as a mere factor in some grander goal, rather than its raison d'etre.

That's usually when all hell breaks loose.

Re: What is vs. what I wish it were

Ben — Tue, 23 Jan 2007 03:36:55 -0000

Another problem with the idea that the federal government needs to maximize the GDP is that, in our Keynesian method of calculating this statistic, government spending counts toward the GDP. Thus, government could simply increase the GDP by increasing taxes, or inflating the money supply, and then spending the money on pork barrel projects.

If the primary task of government is to increase the GDP, and if government spending counts towards the GDP, then socialism would be the best way to maximize our GDP. The government could simply declare a level of GDP, and then print the amount of money needed to get there. Obviously, that's not the way the world works. Government spending is never productive.

Re: What is vs. what I wish it were

PEG — Tue, 23 Jan 2007 01:39:30 -0000

Then how do you suggest government be fixed?

Re: What is vs. what I wish it were

Randy — Mon, 22 Jan 2007 09:48:11 -0000

I was thinking the other day about the folks who are always saying that if we all work together we can accomplish great things - but who will then turn right around and deride the corporations - which are a group of people working together to accomplish great things.

The problem of government isn't an inability to accomplish great things, but in deciding what constitutes a great thing, and which great thing to work on. And of course, some of us think that, to the greatest extent possible, we should be allowed to decide for ourselves which great things we wish to work on.